Path: sparky!uunet!noc.near.net!hri.com!spool.mu.edu!sdd.hp.com!cs.utexas.edu!
zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!usc!sol.ctr.columbia.edu!eff!world!bzs
From: b...@world.std.com (Barry Shein)
Newsgroups: alt.suit.att-bsdi,comp.org.eff.talk,comp.org.sug,comp.org.usenix
Subject: Novell buys Unix Systems Laboratory
Message-ID: <BZS.92Dec21125509@world.std.com>
Date: 21 Dec 92 17:55:09 GMT
Sender: b...@world.std.com (Barry Shein)
Distribution: alt
Organization: The World
Lines: 13
Announced today on the news, $350M, official announcement 2PM EST,
Unix is a trademark of Novell, Inc.
No idea what this portends for the suit against BSDI.
--
-Barry Shein
Software Tool & Die | b...@world.std.com | uunet!world!bzs
Purveyors to the Trade | Voice: 617-739-0202 | Login: 617-739-WRLD
Newsgroups: alt.suit.att-bsdi,comp.org.eff.talk,comp.org.sug,comp.org.usenix
Path: sparky!uunet!pipex!demon!gtoal
From: gt...@pizzabox.demon.co.uk (Graham Toal)
Subject: Re: Novell buys Unix Systems Laboratory
Message-ID: <Bzn7Iy.6rA@demon.co.uk>
Sender: n...@demon.co.uk
Nntp-Posting-Host: pizzabox.demon.co.uk
Organization: Cuddlehogs Anonymous
References: <BZS.92Dec21125509@world.std.com> <1992Dec22.000950.17636@ads.com>
Distribution: alt
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 04:08:57 GMT
Lines: 10
In article <1992Dec22.000950.17...@ads.com> he...@ADS.COM (Henry Mensch) writes:
:b...@world.std.com (Barry Shein) wrote:
:->Announced today on the news, $350M, official announcement 2PM EST,
:->Unix is a trademark of Novell, Inc.
:
:there goes the neighborhood ...
Errr... big question: how will this affect the USL "IT'S UNIX" BSDI lawsuit?
G
Newsgroups: alt.suit.att-bsdi,comp.org.eff.talk,comp.org.sug,comp.org.usenix
Path: sparky!uunet!hela.iti.org!wotan.iti.org!scs
From: s...@iti.org (Steve Simmons)
Subject: Re: Novell buys Unix Systems Laboratory
Message-ID: <scs.725032679@wotan.iti.org>
Sender: use...@iti.org (Hela USENET News System)
Nntp-Posting-Host: wotan.iti.org
Organization: Industrial Technology Institute
References: <BZS.92Dec21125509@world.std.com> <1992Dec22.000950.17636@ads.com>
<Bzn7Iy.6rA@demon.co.uk>
Distribution: alt
Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1992 13:57:59 GMT
Lines: 19
gt...@pizzabox.demon.co.uk (Graham Toal) writes:
>b...@world.std.com (Barry Shein) wrote:
>>Announced today on the news, $350M, official announcement 2PM EST,
>>Unix is a trademark of Novell, Inc.
>Errr... big question: how will this affect the USL "IT'S UNIX" BSDI lawsuit?
IMHO, zero immediate effect. Various shareholders must approve things,
lots of things must change hand, etc, etc. Only when Novell actually
takes possession could they make changes.
But will they make changes? Novell undoubtably knows what the revenue
stream from UNIX licences is. If BSDI/Jolix (yes, I'm sure that Jolix
is the next target) get a full-functioned commercial-grade UNIX
out there that interrupts that license stream, that revenue will begin
to decline quickly.
--
"You can't get here from here."
Newsgroups: alt.suit.att-bsdi,comp.org.eff.talk,comp.org.sug,comp.org.usenix
Path: sparky!uunet!spool.mu.edu!agate!dog.ee.lbl.gov!hellgate.utah.edu!
fcom.cc.utah.edu!cs.weber.edu!terry
From: te...@cs.weber.edu (A Wizard of Earth C)
Subject: Re: Novell buys Unix Systems Laboratory
Message-ID: <1992Dec23.033508.3126@fcom.cc.utah.edu>
Sender: n...@fcom.cc.utah.edu
Organization: Weber State University (Ogden, UT)
References: <1992Dec22.000950.17636@ads.com> <Bzn7Iy.6rA@demon.co.uk>
<scs.725032679@wotan.iti.org>
Distribution: alt
Date: Wed, 23 Dec 92 03:35:08 GMT
Lines: 35
In article <scs.725032...@wotan.iti.org> s...@iti.org (Steve Simmons) writes:
[ ... the USL "IT'S UNIX" BSDI lawsuit ... ]
>But will they make changes? Novell undoubtably knows what the revenue
>stream from UNIX licences is. If BSDI/Jolix (yes, I'm sure that Jolix
>is the next target) get a full-functioned commercial-grade UNIX
>out there that interrupts that license stream, that revenue will begin
>to decline quickly.
This, I believe, is hogwash... I don't think 386BSD will be targeted
unless it contains USL sources like BSDI is purported to (not true of 386BSD
in my opinion).
I also do not believe shareware/freeware/copyleftware is a commercial
threat to USL (no matter who owns them) in any case. People license for
many reasons, not the least of which is commercial support. The most likely
prospect for commercial support in this arena is Linux, from GNU-style
support companies.
Both 386BSD and Linux are out of the water if USL wins against UCB,
as both are making use of Net/2 code (although 386BSD makes rather more
heavy use than Linux) without USL having to fire a shot. Saying USL is
going after 386BSD or Linux is, for the near future, only a potential
threat.
Terry Lambert
te...@icarus.weber.edu
---
Any opinions in this posting are my own and not those of my present
or previous employers.
--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"I have an 8 user poetic license" - me
Get the 386bsd FAQ from agate.berkeley.edu:/pub/386BSD/386bsd-0.1/unofficial
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newsgroups: alt.suit.att-bsdi,comp.org.eff.talk,comp.org.sug,comp.org.usenix
Path: sparky!uunet!mcsun!news.funet.fi!funic!nntp.hut.fi!cs.hut.fi!arl
From: a...@cs.hut.fi (Ari Lemmke)
Subject: Re: Novell buys Unix Systems Laboratory
In-Reply-To: terry@cs.weber.edu's message of Wed, 23 Dec 92 03:35:08 GMT
Message-ID: <ARL.92Dec24175923@deathstar.cs.hut.fi>
Lines: 22
Sender: use...@nntp.hut.fi (Usenet pseudouser id)
Nntp-Posting-Host: deathstar.cs.hut.fi
Organization: Helsinki University of Technology, Finland
References: <1992Dec22.000950.17636@ads.com> <Bzn7Iy.6rA@demon.co.uk>
<scs.725032679@wotan.iti.org> <1992Dec23.033508.3126@fcom.cc.utah.edu>
Distribution: alt
Date: Thu, 24 Dec 1992 15:59:24 GMT
Lines: 22
In article <1992Dec23.033508.3...@fcom.cc.utah.edu> te...@cs.weber.edu
(A Wizard of Earth C) writes:
: Both 386BSD and Linux are out of the water if USL wins against UCB,
: as both are making use of Net/2 code (although 386BSD makes rather more
: heavy use than Linux) without USL having to fire a shot. Saying USL is
: going after 386BSD or Linux is, for the near future, only a potential
: threat.
NO NO NO, do _not_ start this thread again.
Linux kernel is made by Linus Torvalds, not BSD or AT&T.
[Linus has been using or known unix since '90, he has
not seen any AT&T or BSD sources (he's not blind;-)].
PLEASE, _read_ the code then talk again.
KERNEL != some device drivers. RML (although you can't see me ;-)
: Terry Lambert
arl // ha ha ha ha ... is the US filled
// with *s?
Newsgroups: alt.suit.att-bsdi,comp.org.eff.talk,comp.org.sug,comp.org.usenix
Path: sparky!uunet!enterpoop.mit.edu!world!bzs
From: b...@world.std.com (Barry Shein)
Subject: Re: Novell buys Unix Systems Laboratory
In-Reply-To: arl@cs.hut.fi's message of Thu, 24 Dec 1992 15:59:24 GMT
Message-ID: <BZS.92Dec24132749@world.std.com>
Sender: b...@world.std.com (Barry Shein)
Organization: The World
References: <1992Dec22.000950.17636@ads.com> <Bzn7Iy.6rA@demon.co.uk>
<scs.725032679@wotan.iti.org> <1992Dec23.033508.3126@fcom.cc.utah.edu>
<ARL.92Dec24175923@deathstar.cs.hut.fi>
Distribution: alt
Date: Thu, 24 Dec 1992 18:27:49 GMT
Lines: 33
> Linux kernel is made by Linus Torvalds, not BSD or AT&T.
> [Linus has been using or known unix since '90, he has
> not seen any AT&T or BSD sources (he's not blind;-)].
That may be true, however: Emboldened with a favorable court judgement
USL may well push this towards something like look-and-feel, there is
strong language about proprietary concepts in the suit, not merely
copied code.
How many different ways can someone write, for example, namei()? Or
implement BSD-style directory management (now that many BSD features
have been incorporated into SVR4 I assume that USL considers these
concepts their own?)
Mere similarity may become the issue since it would be very hard to
prove that someone (not to mention "everyone who contributed") has
never seen any proprietary code which may have influenced the design
they later chose to implement.
> PLEASE, _read_ the code then talk again.
That's irrelevant unless you can really look at it as a bunch of
lawyers, judges and jurors will see it, and also take into account how
much of a legal battle Linux could withstand to even make their point
(my guess: about zero, and with an unfavorable decision to fight it
will get much more expensive.)
--
-Barry Shein
Software Tool & Die | b...@world.std.com | uunet!world!bzs
Purveyors to the Trade | Voice: 617-739-0202 | Login: 617-739-WRLD
Newsgroups: alt.suit.att-bsdi,comp.org.eff.talk,comp.org.sug,comp.org.usenix
Path: sparky!uunet!mcsun!news.funet.fi!funic!nntp.hut.fi!cs.hut.fi!arl
From: a...@cs.hut.fi (Ari Lemmke)
Subject: Re: Novell buys Unix Systems Laboratory
In-Reply-To: bzs@world.std.com's message of Thu, 24 Dec 1992 18:27:49 GMT
Message-ID: <ARL.92Dec26035229@deathstar.cs.hut.fi>
Lines: 25
Sender: use...@nntp.hut.fi (Usenet pseudouser id)
Nntp-Posting-Host: deathstar.cs.hut.fi
Organization: Helsinki University of Technology, Finland
References: <1992Dec22.000950.17636@ads.com> <Bzn7Iy.6rA@demon.co.uk>
<scs.725032679@wotan.iti.org> <1992Dec23.033508.3126@fcom.cc.utah.edu>
<ARL.92Dec24175923@deathstar.cs.hut.fi>
<BZS.92Dec24132749@world.std.com>
Distribution: alt
Date: Sat, 26 Dec 1992 01:52:30 GMT
Lines: 25
In article <BZS.92Dec24132...@world.std.com> b...@world.std.com (Barry Shein) writes:
: That may be true, however: Emboldened with a favorable court judgement
; USL may well push this towards something like look-and-feel, there is
: strong language about proprietary concepts in the suit, not merely
: copied code.
Gladly our (Finland) law does not know anything about
look and feel (yet). But still scared if GATT will make our
country as a US colony. [after 1.1. there might be some
EEA (?) or EC laws].
Still I do not know if I would cry or laugh very long,
if Linux is not allowed to distribute in USA ;-).
: > PLEASE, _read_ the code then talk again.
:
: That's irrelevant unless you can really look at it as a bunch of
: lawyers, judges and jurors will see it, and also take into account how
please read my earlier post in alt.suit.att-bsdi
(Date: Wed, 16 Dec 1992 04:57:51 GMT).
: -Barry Shein
arl